NextBillGates posts a news article from IGN about a father who neglected his son to play EverQuest. He asked what kind of punishment the man should get, and somehow the conversation turned into what makes an RPG an RPG instead. ~James FP~

Yeah, thank goodness Al Gore didn't become president and Joe Lieberman vice-president. Sure, we may never have spent billions on an unjust war that has cost the lives of thousands and the economy may not have spiraled into a complete downward slump with record unemployment rates and skyrocketing fuel costs, but hey, no one will take our videogames away!

...? How is ezboard supposed to fix this problem? =/

While I probably shouldn't doubt the credibility of a news source that calls itself "Lum the Mad", I still have to question just how "dirty and neglected" a room has to be before it's a "pure sign of addiction". I wouldn't exactly say we're living in squalor here, but I don't think our tiny-ass apartment is the tidiest in the world, either.

Uh, whoah, wait a minute here... So, he's not just a single father, his wife lives there, too, and SHE'S not doing anything to clean the apartment or take care of the kids, either? How is this the game's fault at all, then? There's something this news story isn't telling has the suspicious odor of media videogame demonizing to me...

FO may be offering an uninformed opinion (or purposefully being a Forum Jackass, as it's sometimes hard to tell with her), but I still find it difficult to believe that half the people who play EverQuest hate it, but won't stop playing it anyway. I won't deny the game has some addictive properties (although I haven't actually played it myself and never will), but that's just plain ridiculous.

You know, why am I not suprised that someone like Termite would get addicted to EverQuest?

While, again, I won't argue that EverQuest can't be addictive for some people, I don't really see why it's so unbelievable that someone might not think they'd personally get addicted to the game even if they haven't played it. Yeah, Ogre Battle 64 can be addicting, allright, but I've certainly known people who weren't able to complete it because of how long it is. I've beaten it twice and feel no desire to go back to it. Not only that, but I didn't play it nonstop and neglect everything else in my life. FO is having a difficult time swallowing the "addiction" argument because she is like me in this matter, and also (as I pointed out) that article is suspicious. Putting 100% of the blame on the game is ludicrous when the guy was also a drug-addict, and a boozer, and his wife is apparently doing absolutely nothing at all.

AH HA HA HA!! I just had to jump in and be my normal jackassity self.

Because drugs, alcoholism, and a catatonic wife could not possibly have anything to do with it.

Okay, Termite, so which is it? You seem to waffle back and forth between putting most (if not all) of the blame on the game, and saying it was a combination of the other problems, too. And what the hell @ "he probably died or something"??? What, do you think he had a heart attack and restarted it by pounding on his chest like Chris Farley in a Superfans sketch on SNL?

And so the Peanut Gallery joins the debate. Okay, Termite is waffling more than my local IHOP and he's kind of annoying in the way he constantly attempts to vindicate his own addiction to the damn game, but he's not entirely wrong.

Uh, yes you did. You said, and I quote, "The neglect of the child IS because of EQ, believe me."

So where is the wife when all of this is going on, again?


You know, Termite, it's not so much that you're wrong. It's the fucking obnoxious way you go about it. Note: I really hate people who declare themselves the winner of an argument and act like their opinions are completely infallible. The fact that you're using your own addiction as evidence, yet you still managed to pull yourself away from the game long enough to act like a spoiled little snit on our forums all the time isn't exactly helping your case.

The addictiveness of Tetris was definitely overstated. Same with SimCity.

Okay, did I miss something here? Who defined an RPG as "anything with level building"? I don't see it anywhere, unless a post was deleted. I also can't believe Termite seriously doesn't think people cannot become bored with RPGs.

FO has an excellent follow-up post about "hidden menus" to this later, so I won't bother answering to this right now.

It sounds to me like they are RPGs, but Termite just isn't doing a very good job of describing them (that's not exactly one of his strong points, ey?) And how the fuck can you level-build if there are no battles??? Something isn't adding up here.

Okay, now Termite's not making any sense at all. Moving on...

Okay...I have no idea what this is about now...

What is a "Frickin' L"?? I guess it's just another of the many wonders of Mitch da Bitch.

Oh Jesus Christ, a War of Extremely Petty Semantics begins...

TermiteJr: He corrects one typo only to make another.

?? That's a weird thing to say...

Ladies and gentlemen, uncork the wine bottles, AT LAST - the Voice of John Q. Internet has entered the building!! Hang on for the ride, folks. This user is about to go where no user has gone before. Now before I begin, and this is VERY IMPORTANT TO KNOW - there is an ezboard glitch happening at this time that causes a bunch of users to NOT BE ABLE TO SEE THIS GUY'S POSTS. So, bear in mind that for most of the entire rest of this topic, MOST PEOPLE CANNOT SEE USER BSSTEPH'S POSTS!! So, this guy is about to go on an arguing tirade against people who are not paying any attention to him because they can't see him, and at some point, he actually becomes aware of the fact that he's being ignored, yet it doesn't stop him from acting like the posts are directed at him anyway... Here goes...

First off, I have no idea WHY he wants people to argue specifically with him, but since his first post is practically accusing a long-time reg that he doesn't even know from Adam of never having played an RPG before, I can only assume it's because he's LOOKING for trouble.

And I'm sorry, I'm a total geek, too, but I still have to LOL @ anyone whose first post on a message board is boldly proclaiming he's played more RPGs than anyone else in the universe.

Yeah, that clarified everything allright.

Dev should write for the Metal Gear Solid series.

If you feel like you've lost a few brain cells right about now, don't worry. You're not alone.

Wow! What a miserable little fucktard. Vampyrus makes a very eloquent and articulate post, and his response is to accuse him of not being able to read and being off-topic (when he's not), while simultaneously using the phrase "for all intensive purposes" when it should be "for all intents and purposes". I don't know if that indicates this little nuisance can read or not, but it DOES indicate that he's using a phrase without having any idea what it means.

Oh, and I find it funny that he accuses Dev of not being able to read when he's apparently reading stuff that doesn't even exist, seeing as how Dev said nothing to him since he can't see his posts.

What the fuckity fuck fuck? You just said, "Your points are unrelated to this discussion," and then several paragraphs later in the SAME POST you say, "Your points are valid in this paragraph". What do you think this is? The "Try to Waffle Even More Than TermiteJr" topic?

And let me get something straight here: I realize that it is the opinion of some people that ONLY table-top RPGs are TRUE RPGs. However, when people are discussing what a TRUE RPG is on a VIDEOGAME message board, they are discussing it in terms of VIDEOGAMES. Whether or not tabletop RPGs are the only true RPGs is completely irrelevant. But fine, you can have your opinion. State it and be done with it. But it's the aggressive way in which that's simply not enough for this guy and he's purposefully instigating people to argue with him over it and inciting flamewars that's pissing me off.

"And actually, if you think about it, in most games you ARENT actually playing the role of your characters."


Give me a fucking break, Jr! How many game boxes, manuals, and reviews say things like, "This game puts you in the role of 'Main Character' as you follow his mission to blah blah..."

Uh, Shigeru Miyamoto himself has said that he doesn't give his characters personalities because he wants fans to use their own imaginations and come up with their own ideas for them. So, someone imagining Mario having thoughts about what he's doing is no crazier than you imagining the mute heroes in an RPG have personalities. And there are plenty of RPGs with characters that have defined personalities and roles that cannot be changed. Just ask all the people who tried to revive Aeris or General Leo. Really, this is about as stupid as GH64's "it must have a story about saving the world" definition of an RPG.

"Blah, blah, blah...These replies obviously have nothing to do with anything I said, but I'm going to act like they do anyway because, blah, blah, blah, I'm right, you're wrong, shut up, blah, blah, blah, and tabletop RPGs are the only TRUE RPGs and I'm gonna say it every single time someone says something even remotely related to console RPGs in this topic, blah, blah, blah."

LOL, Pero!!

Only in the unnavigable labyrinth of your deluded inner mind, Termite.

I've been feeling that throughout most of this topic Termite has been arguing just for the sake of being contrary, but I digress...

By this definition, every fighting game ever made is an RPG (except Rise of the Robots and Ultraman).

Dateline 2001: After nearly 3 decades, a TRUE RPG is finally here!! There has never been one before, according to online gaming experts, TermiteJr and Bssteph.

.... I have no idea what you're saying here, DC. FO has way more of a point than Kai did. If he complains at one board that we can't have discussions because of people whining about debate topics, then immediately turns around and becomes one of the people complaining about the debate topics, then yes, that's being a hypocrite. (No offense to you, my good buddy, Kai, you were just young and angsty.)

If the topic bores you so badly, then why are you posting in it? And of course FO is the worst person in a debate you've ever seen! It's because you aren't listening to a fucking word she's saying! But she's still nowhere near as bad as seeing you argue with yourself and YOU putting words in other people's mouths, and imagining replies to you in their posts that aren't there, but again I digress...

Okay, now he's BLATANTLY inviting flamewars. At least he's not being pretentious about THAT.

It's not the topic, buddy.

Okay, let's suppose for a moment that this wasn't a glitch and people simply weren't replying to him because they didn't have anything to say to his particular arguments. What if they've just never played AD&D or a Tabletop RPG of any kind? Just because they haven't, that doesn't mean they aren't qualified to discuss what an RPG is in VIDEOGAME terms, but that's basically what this idiot is saying.

So in other words, you're making statements on games that you've never even played.

"...but I'm not a total dumbass about gaming."

Yes you are.

That is what you basically said. Both of you. If that isn't what you're saying, then your argument has no point.

The glitch is finally undone, and Bssteph's brain-melting posts have finally been unleashed on the unsuspecting public. Of course, FO does the noble thing and apologizes, even though the situation was not her fault, she never said a WORD to him, and he was going off on her for no apparent reason.

But not without delivering this eloquent coup de grace response to his retarded Seiken Densetsu argument.

I wish I'd said more back then, but I hadn't yet gone through and read them all.

I could not agree with CB007 more here. It certainly doesn't help when it's not enough for someone to simply state his opinion but keeps ramming it down everyone's throats over and over again because no one's responding to it, but he's going to act like they are because...Jeez! Why the hell were people this nutzoid always finding this board??

It was a mercy killing, FO.

Ugh, I hate glazed donuts. What the hell even is the glazing? It's like this nasty sticky solidified sugar slime.

For the love of all that is good in the universe, please NO!

Newsflash: When the replies to your arguments aren't making any sense whatsoever and have nothing to do with what you're talking about, then I think it's pretty safe to assume they aren't replies to you. But John Q. Internet has an OPINION and he's going to EXPRESS it!


You've heard it here first, boys and girls! Only games that Bssteph and TermiteJr, the World's Greatest Gaming Experts with 3 whole years of experience playing the N64 and going to N-Sider Chat, are TRUE RPGs. Everything else is fake.

Maybe next time, Daryn. Maybe next time.

This is also a PRIME example of WHY the Game Pond's policy on "just ignore it and it'll go away" does NOT work.

And, now the aftermath. 6 years later, I found and revived this topic (I'm not putting my revival posts in this archive because I already worked everything I said into the commentary, but FO and Crawl had some more to say, too...)

And that was that post about "hidden menus" I mentioned earlier. That's all for now. Goodnight, folks!

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